This pic makes me want to change my profession

[Balandar]

Wish I had artsy skills.

[Maga]

Holy cow! She's No wonder people love that game so much. I have seen some very pretty beings in that game. And scantily clad as well.

Maga (Hunters Moon)

[Reafia]

too bad that isnt in hte game >.

[Swann]

Yeah...the graphics are good...but they aren't THAT good.

I'm wondering though...what is the facination with Twi'leks, anyways? That's a curiousity question, don't read anything negative in that.

[Reafia]

Nothin =p I'd much rather have a full human anyday

(i'm scaring myself)

[Balandar]

Yeah...the graphics are good...but they aren't THAT good.

I'm wondering though...what is the facination with Twi'leks, anyways? That's a curiousity question, don't read anything negative in that.

I think it's that whole alien pink/blue/green skin type of thing. Whatever color happens to be your favorite. Don’t get me wrong though, Sil... human women are lots of fun as well.

[Siluial]

no offense taken.

Hell, if I were into aliens, I'd be all over the first Twi'lek. I mean, just imagine what they can do with those lekkus .....

*^^*

And we all know Bal, you gotta thing for me. We're still wiping up the... mud stains ... in the house.

[Swann]

Well, in this game, they can't even change the lekku position without an image designer, I'm not wondering too much

[Daav_Teirson]

I don't mean to be a stick in the mud but...that is just Poser. It's a program, that allows you to position a model anyways you want. You can change body mass, breast size, eye shape, anything. Actually it's alot like when you make your character in the begining. I personally consider the program "cheating". I have no fascination with Twi'Leks in anyway whatsoever.

[Balandar]

We know it's not a real pic Daav. Reason why I said "Wish I had artsy skills". I have used poser before, but was never able to obtain anything that looked that good.

[Swann]

I have (see my profile for some of the PS of past characters), but I don't have any fun ones of Swann with a captured graphic from the game because my own computer's been down.

Hopefully, that'll be resolved soon, and I can go back to manipulating images for fun & profit.

[Daav_Teirson]

I was jsut stating from an artists point of view that I consider poser "cheap" but that's just me. I never thought that you guys thought it was a real picture. I was just explaining that poser pretty much builds the model for you and allows you, through a series of windows, to manipulate the model easily.

[Reafia]

so are you saying those who use Poser... are "posers"??

[Chris]

cheap? Poser looks rather expensive to me

[Balandar]

Poser is not very cheap, costs $$$. I only had the chance to use it at college. Still, I think it is awesome.

Why spend tons of hours making one picture when you can do it in poser in what... 1/3rd of the time. I would love to get my hands on a copy and just make battle scene's and the like, just for fun. That and Twi'leks

[Daav_Teirson]

I meant "cheap" as in cutting corners...I can't tell sarcasm in words sorry LOL.

"Why spend tons of hours making one picture when you can do it in poser in what... 1/3rd of the time."

because it's taking someone elses hardwork and calling it your own. Once again I'm talking from a 2d/3d illustraitors point of view. It's along the same lines as tracing. You didn't really put the sweat and tears into the art. You didn't go through the tedious wielding all vertices, you didn't flip 75% of the faces to make the polygons look correct.

For someone just having fun and fooling around I'm sure it's great...but once again...From an artists point of view...I think it's "cheap".

[Swann]

Gotta disagree with you for once, Daav...it's a tool. Your arguement is akin to saying that your should get your own pigments from nature to mix your paints, sneak up behind a horse and pull your own hairs to make the brush, etc.

Now, someone can lazily grab a Poser model, slap something out, and call it art...yeah, that's cheap. Or simply a hobbiest who doesn't know how to do anything more (in which case, there's a good chance some sweat was shed trying to figure out how to use the program).

But in the end, Poser is a tool...even used by a friend of mine as a sort of digital maquette to help her visualize things before she draws it, which I find wonderfully funny...that can be abused or used to great effect (see Rick Barry or Dave McKean, probably).

[Daav_Teirson]

I know it's a tool and I understand how it can be usful in certain situations. Like your friend using it to give a base idea on how she wants her drawing to go. Sure, I understand that, and say go for it. But like I said, as a 3d illustraitor, making 3d models like the one there in the pic, to me is cheap. The finding the hair for a brush and pigments for color is a bit off though. It would be more along the lines of programming where each vertex tic should be, instead of using a mouse with 3D studio max or autocad. Using poser as a final product isn't right to me. I mean what shoulder be valued more?

1- The cake that was made from scratch?

2- Or the cake that was bought from the store then had some decorations put on it to make it more personalized?

1- The Harley that was built from scratch. Having the parts ordered then putting them together?

2- Or the Harley that was bought completed then had a few modifications added on it?

This is the way I look at it. As far as using it for 3D modeling as a final product. To me, it's a way to by-pass the hard work that goes with making a 3D model. The artist that is the same level as I am cannot compare his sweat and tears to mine if he used poser. It's the love of doing art is my final point, poser (in the sense of a final product) just seems to destore the beauty of it, IMO.

Once again, if someone is using it to have fun that doesn't have the same amount of talent as a 3D illustraitor then go at it. But to be honest I don't take poser seriously. Aside from using it as a reference.

[MArkham]

So you will be using assembly or machine code to write the code to place those pixels correct?

Or will you be using a refined progrming language that allows you cheat the pure process of programing in machine language.

The point is they are all just tools to exand the ability of the people using them. To say I prefer to not use poser cause it is cheap just means you want to do it a harder way.

[Soke]

I think it's a moot point. The idea about art isn't about HOW you got there, but the finished product. It doesn't matter what tools you use as long as whatever point or idea the artist was trying to convey is conveyed.

[Daav_Teirson]

I'm talking about the talent of the artist, I suppose. The finished product is what matters to the people looking at it when it's completed, true. I wouldn't buy a painting knowing someone used poser. I would never say, "He's a great artist", based on that picture of the Twi'Lek. I look at that picture of the Twi'Lek and go, "Oh that's clever. It looks good." But do I value his art more then the person who would have painted it from scratch? No. Do I value my paintings on photoshop more then I value the paintings on canvas? No. Yes, we have tools to use to make things easier. But eventually, it's the tools doing the work and not the artist.

Here's another example as to how I, I stress "I", look at it. Which body do I value more? The one who used steroids? Or the one that took the time and effort to get those muscles to that mass without taking the easy way? Has anyone seen a body builder and gone, "Oh but I heard he uses steroids." I know this isn't much of an issue now then it was years ago. But I hope you seen this point I'm making. To me there's more to art then the final product. It's the way the artist did the final product. The degree of talent lessens with the use of more tools. That doesn't mean to say that the artist using poser isn't talented, nor does it mean his imagination is any less. Measuring imagination just seems gross to me.

Yes tools extend our ability. But like I said, eventually the tools do the work for us. The more the tool does, the less talent it takes. does this mean I like doing art " the hard way"? I guess it does.

This is my opinion. I'm an artist, ruled by my imagination and desire to draw. Take my opinion for what it is, an artists opinion. I don't mean to speak for anyone other then myself and the other artists I"ve talked to concerning this topic. Trying to understand an artist, in most cases, is moot.

I'll keep reading this thread but I don't see why I should keep explaining my opinion. I've said everything I felt about the topic. Any other statements or questions about my opinion...well the reply or answer is in one of my posts.

[Chris]

The true measure of an artist's worth is not what tools he uses, but his ability to satisfy his own need for self-expression and, to a lesser extent, to evoke a response within those who view his work.

Judging by the length of this thread, the artist has apparently done a pretty good job at the latter.

[Swann]

"But eventually, it's the tools doing the work and not the artist."

Actually, my belief is that that is a backwards statement.

At the start, the tools do the work...and eventually, the artist does.

This applies to paper and pen, as well as more complex tools. Look at Terry Moore's original comic strips, then look at Strangers in Paradise.

Every artist works in some mediums better than others. (For an extremem comparisson, check out Dave McKean's photoshop work vrs his hand-drawn) Every artist seizes the tools of that medium better than other mediums. Harlan Ellison typed some of his best stuff out on a manual typewriter, and Lois McMaster Bujold probably used a word processor. I don't really care what they used, they were able to translate their thoughts to a medium.

I mean, seriously, Star Wars A New Hope was formatted by hand, and Episode I used a script formatter, and....wait, that example might be counter productive....