Lotara Posted February 6, 2003 Share Posted February 6, 2003 Hello All, I would like to address an issue that I think is impacting the Guild in a very serious way. Namely the number of alternates in the Guild and their low levels. I think this is a problem because I see so many players that I do not recognize that are alts and often do not display class and level. There are so many Alt below the 35 level required for Members. So many at the lower levels that we at the higher levels have difficulty getting into groups with Guildmates. I feel the Guild is for the Mains and a few high level Alts and in order to be a Raid Guild we should put our efforts into those characters. Playing low level Alts is fun and I have my share, but most of mine are not in the Guild. If you cannot get Guild Chat as an Alt then maybe you will decided which Alts are important to you and play those important ones more often. This will straighten the guild with fewer, higher, level players. I would like to suggest that the officers adopt a policy that for each account, there be one main and no more than two alternates. The mains would have to be over 35 (present policy) and the alts would have to be over 20. If you get an alt to 20 you will probably continue to play them. This would make it much easier to keep track of guild members/alts for such things as Raid Loot, Guild Meetings, and other Guild Events. All characters with Guild Tags would have to be in the Guild Roster and their levels show their true level (not 5 levels back). If an officer, or other character, sees a person with the Guild Tag and who is not on the Roster, that person would be warned once and then eliminated from the guild. I love the new feature that Eldy showed us about the new Guild Management Tool. But do we all have to have that expansion to be able to use it? Are we going to reguire Guildmates to have expansions? Like the Raid expansion? Please think about what you want to say before you answer this. We don't need hate mail but we do need some clear thoughts and reasons why you are for or against what I have said. Regards, Lotara (Tara) Bard of 42 Songs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lolanya1 Posted February 7, 2003 Share Posted February 7, 2003 I agree! Yes, even though I have 4 people in the guild, I agree that there should be a set-in-stone minimum level for alts and a finite number allowed in. The only problem I see with this arguement is, like a few others already in the guild, I already have more than the suggested 2 alts in SLoT. What should give here? I should dump one or two alts in favor of others to SLoT? Or does this grandfather present alts IF they meet the minimum level requirement of 20 or 25 (I really think it should be 30, because I can PL a character to 20 in a matter of a few hours). In order to be an effective high-level raid-type guild, we must maintain a core of people above 46 who play regularly and have some sort of end-goal in mind. That end goal can be a particular treasure or treasures, or entry to a higher level dungeon or zone, or placement and then advancement in the Tier ranking system, or leveling and skilling to maximum impact. Whatever the goal, the importance is building a cohesive force of knowledgable people. If that means paring down the total number of guildmembers by removing selected alts, I'm all in favor of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lotara Posted February 8, 2003 Author Share Posted February 8, 2003 You present some good points and questions. 1. I believe that most people can choose which three out of a possible eight characters they want in the guild at any one time. This could change occasionally like say a max of four or six times a year. I would say no grandfathering in of alts. They would be admitted when they reach the minimum level. An incentive to work harder if they want that Alt in the guild. Zann is not my first cleric, I did not like the status on the other one and decided to go with a Hi Elf this time. McMikahl is also a second attempt as the same class of character (McMichael). In both of these cases the Guild got a better characters. And I also have many characters above 35 that could be alts. I choose not to play them to concentrate on Zann and Lotara (Tara) and my two druids (all of them above 42). 2. As I get higher levels, I realize it takes more time to level a character and maintain all of their stats at max. I also realize there are times that I do not have the time to spend on a major group activity and like to play an alt for an hour or two. This you can do easily with lower level characters. 3. We could also allow non-alt character of a guild member on raids if approved by Eldoran or Raid Leader in advance. But for the good of the Guild, we need to have as many members above 50 as we can. So guildmembers will have to make decisions, if this change goes through, on which characters to have as Alts in the guild. Regards, Tara and Zann Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lotara Posted February 10, 2003 Author Share Posted February 10, 2003 Hummmm, since I have not gotten to many replys, I will assume (ass u me) that everyone agrees with me. Regards, Tara Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nurlaten Posted February 10, 2003 Share Posted February 10, 2003 Alts are a personal choice of what each person wants for their EQ experience. I know when i joined a guild (TKO at the time), the reasons were to have people to chat with and group/raiding wasn't a primary concern. My goals from a guild have since changed and I'm looking for a raiding experience (from what i've heard so are many other members). I've recently stripped and deleted 3 alts (2 were in guild, one wasn't), so my sole focus in EQ is Nurlaten. I don't think this should be required of every member, but limiting alts is probably a good idea. I enjoy alts, i've played almost ever class in the game til atleast level 20, and believe this makes me a better player. It's nice to know what each class brings to the table and being able to know their capabilities. But i also know if i'm going to contribute to SLoT, my contributions are going to come from Nurlaten, not a lvl 10 necro twink.... The question of changing requirements for alts is really asking if we as a guild are going from a "friends and family atmosphere" to a "high end raiding guild." This is a choice we as a guild have to make and just voted on last month, either way, were gonna lose some people that are looking for the other aspect.... The reason i got my alts in the guild was so if anyone needed Nurlaten, i would know and be able to help, by shutting alts out, you injure a persons ability to communicate. If we are gonna limit the number of alts, what comes next? Raising level for new invites?, requiring members to be able to raid 4 times a week? This simple question is much more complex and strikes at what type of guild SLoT will be in the future. Personally i would like to see alts required to be atleast level 20 or possibly higher and increase main's level requirements to level 45. [Grandfathering in people, but strongly recommending they reduce number of alts and/or level their main]. I know we've lost some members in their low 40's recently because the majority of stuff we do if geared for our 50's players, so why not just make them wait til they are high enough to contribute to join? I've just rambled a lot, and hopefully given everyone something to think about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rumblebore Posted February 11, 2003 Share Posted February 11, 2003 Nurlaten - You bring the point up very well. I hope people dont miss it. To move to a raiding Guild is to lose some of the atmosphere that we have as a non-raiding guild. It WILL happen. Expectations of members WILL change and be more attendance oriented. In order to become one of the Raiding guilds, and to take down really tough mobs, we NEED to change our gameplay and become more focused and dedicated to raiding, above other game concerns. The price tag for this wil be the loss of people who dont want to lose that feel, that home-like atmosphere. There will still be a deep-friendship and comaraderie feel, but it will differ from what we have. Most of those higher levels who have left wanted that dedicated gaming feel and went looking for it. They wanted something SLoT didnt have. It was not an easy decision for them. But to grow - they needed to leave. Now we stand ready to take new steps. Things will change, and we will lose people. Please be ready to accept the price tag for change. Regarding Alts - I still have 6 alts, one of whom only a very few know of. That character is so I can get away from SLoT almost entirely. The others are known to many, and I have a total of 3 in guild, although one of those I almost never play. I agree that reduction of alts is a good idea if we move to a raiding guild. We would need to rely on people to dedicate their activity to one or maybe 2 characters so as to develop evenly. My 2c. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leanessa Sylverfoxx Posted February 11, 2003 Share Posted February 11, 2003 Before I reply to this I would like to think more about it...but just wanted to let you know that I have read it and am thinking about it... Leanessa Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaqs Posted February 13, 2003 Share Posted February 13, 2003 I think that all the low lvl atl's are destroying this guild. i would like to see the mains in this guild grow. we are lacking many pure caster classes and flooded with shammys, warriors and druids. its crippling the ability to funtion as a raid guild. i would like to see stricter guidelines for officers when they are recruting. and mabey change enterance lvl to 40-45. this is just my 2cents and not to offend anyone. i like to hunt with u all just now that i am high lvl i want to see more and im questioning the abillity of this guild to get there. i would just like to add that i joined this guild when i was lvl 1 so i am in a way talking about my own charactor. but ive past that now and its no longer an issue. lets mabey get a low lvl guild to take in all the low lvl alts we have. so they no longer distract the real goal of getting us ALL our epic's and raiding 1,2 or even 3 times a week. becouse thats what we need is really good raid skills to take down the PoP main bosses to get flagged for even higher PoP zones to get better drops and so on and so forth... I hope the new guild management window will be put to good use and thin out the alts and to inforce the mains role. Jaqs 58 warrior Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcmichael Posted February 19, 2003 Share Posted February 19, 2003 i have read the posts,more than once....the problem i see with alts are ppl jump to the alt when no one says,HEY so and so,we are here,come join us.....the problem i see tends to be that everyone wants to get in a group but not start one......learning to start a group and choose a destination maybe the best way for many of us to learn to organize and lead a "raid".i often send tells when i am trying to start a group and get atleast one person before saying in guild that i want to head to such and such zone.....it seems to work best for me that way,get one or 2 ppl who want to go to said zone before asking guild in general to go......pls try that before jumping to an allt to find an easy piok up group,it works,honest!try it..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lolanya1 Posted February 20, 2003 Share Posted February 20, 2003 It is easy to find possible reasons WHY people use alts. I have five of them myself. Sometimes people tire of playing in the same capacity night after night. Sometimes people want to rediscover a zone or situation they enjoyed in the past. Sometimes people want to develop an alternate method of grouping or being alone or tradeskilling or whatever. The point is not that we have and use such alts, but that we need to concentrate on mains over alts. My EQ-long journey has been frought with deciding on who iinterests me most at any one time. I have been through the Ranger, Cleric, Necro, Druid, Enchanter, Wizard, Mage, Rogue, and Warrior phases. I now have turned whole-heartedly to my Monk phase. I hope that Shansa will continue to excite me to play EQ daily. I have leveled her 10 times in the past 6 weeks and hope to continue to do so as rapidly even as I level my other alts. All of this drabble is being said to point out that all of these characters are alts of my main, Baldaek. If I were to truely play only my main, as has been suggested by a previous poster within this thread, I would not be expressing my thoughts in a SLoT forum; Baldaek is in another guild. Alts, to me, are pivital in my enjoyment of EQ. I would not be where I am now without them. I refuse to stop playing them. I do wish to further SLoT's new objectives, to raid higher, to achieve higher-end goals, to become more than we are now. To that end I will concentrate on my main character(s) (I now claim to have 3, 2 in SLoT). I will pledge to become planar as soon as I possibly can. I will pledge to desist on my alts when it is at all possible to play a main. I do this assuming the characters, themselves, stop discussing with me what they want... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Krung Posted February 26, 2003 Share Posted February 26, 2003 Ah Yes I must Agree Lolanya. I play my Wizard alt frankly because I cant play Krung (my warrior main) in Character in this guild. It is too raid oriented now and Krung is too stupid be organized. (he is an Ogre after all). Anyway therefore to be of use in this guild I am lvling my wizzy as quickly as possible. See yall on the planes soon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lotara Posted February 27, 2003 Author Share Posted February 27, 2003 And I would like to add my 3 cents in also. A lot of people know that I have three accounts full of characters. It is not that I dislike alts, I love all of my girls and enjoy playing all of them for the same reasons Lolanya stated. I also think it has made Zann a better cleric knowing what to expect and what is needed for other classes. It is interesting in my three years in EQ to see those people that still (not characters) that are still around because people do come and go. Those that stay usually have several characters and enjoy starting new one. Also, another reason for Alt is that I cannot play EQ as much as others and sometimes only for an hour or two (not 12 hour Raids). This is when I play my alts (I choose from among 24 characters). However, I also agree with Jaqs and Mcmickahl's focus on only one character. We need both. I also agree with Mcm that not too many people are willing to start/lead groups. In this I think that Mcm really is a leader and is trying to pull this guild together instead of having everyone doing their own thing. Eldoran is a leader also. Anytime these two want groups they can get them. I am slowly learning about the people above 50 now that Zann is above 50. Lolanya put it very clearly about what the quild will become one way or the other, a Guild cannot survive if trying to do both. I have been playing EQ for over three years as have several others in the Guild. I have seen Guilds come and go and the ones still around seem to have several things in common: A core group of people that like hunting together and like each other and a calandar where activities can be planned in advance. i.e. Guild Raids on three days/nights and Experience Groups on several days/nights. And fun activities occasionally. A place where we can see what is planned and by whom on what dates and times. Also a place to pre-register for the activities so leaders can see who thinks they can make it (subject to last minute changes which always occur). This makes for preplanning of groups in Raids so start up does not take so long. Calendars are useful to me because many times I can plan my work schedule around a time slot and make sure that Zann is there. Pickup groups she usually misses. And Zann would love to be a level 60 Cleric with Epic. But time commentments at this time make it hard to achieve those goals. It would be interesting once the guild gets it's roster on the Management Tool down to who are still actually in the Guild, and to take only the mains and let them re-vote on some of these questions in a new pole. 1. What should be the minimum age for Mains? 35 40 45 50 55 2. What should be the minimum age for Alts? 0 10 20 30 40 3. Should there be a limit to the number of alts in the guild? no limit 2 5 10 4. What should be the focus of this Guild? (using the questions Rumblebore put together) Thanks all for the input to my first question in this Chat. Tara and Zann Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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